Comments on: What Dickens Scrooge Should Teach Us — Farrell http://www.themoralliberal.com/2009/12/25/what-dickens-scrooge-should-teach-us-farrell/ Defending the Judeo-Christian ethic, limited government, & the American Constitution Mon, 13 Feb 2012 16:49:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Steve Farrell http://www.themoralliberal.com/2009/12/25/what-dickens-scrooge-should-teach-us-farrell/comment-page-1/#comment-92 Steve Farrell Mon, 28 Dec 2009 02:15:55 +0000 http://centerformoralliberalism.wordpress.com/?p=4015#comment-92 I ought to add what Lenin in his famous essay on Internationalism had to say, and that was his prediction for a worldwide fascist styled government (which consistent with your corporatism) would emerge. This also goes by a few other names like the Third Way, Futurism, Progressivism, Compassionate Conservatism, Centre-Right Government, Centre-Left Government, whatever, even Keynes called for this model in his two-part "Death of Laisezz-Faire" pieces e.g. public-private partnerships and the whole nine yards of what Clinton, Gore, Blaire, Gingrich, Toffler, Bush, etc., have been pushing for, and what was the model in Perestroika (at least the one that I read in Gorbachev's book) that was called for. Rambling .... Lenin's prediction: The establishment of a worldwide fascist styled government that would on a sudden, a dime, a snap of the fingers turn to full blown communism. Whether that will happen or not remains to be seen; and while I think that not every one involved (in fact very few) really have this sort of a thing in mind, such people really do get into power, and really do have such plans. I'm less concerned about how I will prosper or not under socialism (which is a grave problem as well) as I am concerned about centralized power structures -- it is in the latter that liberty is all the more easily crushed. You mentioned in one of your notes about Republicans legislating from the bench, and that is a great point. For those who trust the Republicans to bring them Constitutional government they are so wrong for that trust. They establish abuse of power precedents that are sometimes used at first in what seem to be positive ways, but the violation of principle, once established, only takes an activist to take that same power in a radically more abusive direction. I ought to add what Lenin in his famous essay on Internationalism had to say, and that was his prediction for a worldwide fascist styled government (which consistent with your corporatism) would emerge. This also goes by a few other names like the Third Way, Futurism, Progressivism, Compassionate Conservatism, Centre-Right Government, Centre-Left Government, whatever, even Keynes called for this model in his two-part “Death of Laisezz-Faire” pieces e.g. public-private partnerships and the whole nine yards of what Clinton, Gore, Blaire, Gingrich, Toffler, Bush, etc., have been pushing for, and what was the model in Perestroika (at least the one that I read in Gorbachev’s book) that was called for.

Rambling …. Lenin’s prediction: The establishment of a worldwide fascist styled government that would on a sudden, a dime, a snap of the fingers turn to full blown communism. Whether that will happen or not remains to be seen; and while I think that not every one involved (in fact very few) really have this sort of a thing in mind, such people really do get into power, and really do have such plans. I’m less concerned about how I will prosper or not under socialism (which is a grave problem as well) as I am concerned about centralized power structures — it is in the latter that liberty is all the more easily crushed. You mentioned in one of your notes about Republicans legislating from the bench, and that is a great point. For those who trust the Republicans to bring them Constitutional government they are so wrong for that trust. They establish abuse of power precedents that are sometimes used at first in what seem to be positive ways, but the violation of principle, once established, only takes an activist to take that same power in a radically more abusive direction.

]]> By: Steve Farrell http://www.themoralliberal.com/2009/12/25/what-dickens-scrooge-should-teach-us-farrell/comment-page-1/#comment-91 Steve Farrell Mon, 28 Dec 2009 01:41:40 +0000 http://centerformoralliberalism.wordpress.com/?p=4015#comment-91 Corporatism: I haven't heard that term for a while. Some also call it state monopoly capitalism. Both are a nicer name for fascism; and frankly, the more the two (the state and the corporation) are welded the less likely it will be that the corporation is the shot caller if it still is. If we want to take Lenin's black book definition of the ism's I think we see through them all as this: "it's all about power." Or whatever works at the moment to move the revolution forward. Whether the corporation is in charge or being exploited is of little difference in the effects, and in the final end. I agree with you wholeheartedly that both parties are ultimately in on this, though at least for the moment the national Republicans are opposed for strategic (the 2010 elections) reasons. I truly do not believe that on the National level any of these Republicans are very different from their Democratic Party foes, I mean in fine print legislation, not in the propaganda they push on us. On the other hand I do believe it socialism is enslaving and that fully socializing medicine is a big step toward interfering in the most private of decisions. The fact that we are already far down that road isn't the point for those who are trying to preserve the Constitution, they are rather excited that finally an awakening has come and hope that this will go far beyond rejecting national healthcare but rolling back the entire state influence on this and other industries. Another point to consider, and maybe you will agree, I was reading something about 18th and early 19th Century socialist experiments in America, the reviewer observed that what success they had (which wasn't much) had much to do with the fact that it was surrounded by a prosperous capitalist system. I've argued this for some time about let's say Switzerland that has quite a bit of capitalist money over the years stored in its banks -- and how many socialist states have stayed afloat with American grants, investments, loans, and technology? But what happens when America finally goes the distance, what happens to those countries, and to what free and prosperous nation will we lean on? This is, I believe, a legitimate concern. Some used to say that when the lights go out in America the lights will go out on the world. I tend to believe that. Ben, have a happy New Year and thank you for your thought provoking comments! Corporatism: I haven’t heard that term for a while. Some also call it state monopoly capitalism. Both are a nicer name for fascism; and frankly, the more the two (the state and the corporation) are welded the less likely it will be that the corporation is the shot caller if it still is. If we want to take Lenin’s black book definition of the ism’s I think we see through them all as this: “it’s all about power.” Or whatever works at the moment to move the revolution forward. Whether the corporation is in charge or being exploited is of little difference in the effects, and in the final end.

I agree with you wholeheartedly that both parties are ultimately in on this, though at least for the moment the national Republicans are opposed for strategic (the 2010 elections) reasons. I truly do not believe that on the National level any of these Republicans are very different from their Democratic Party foes, I mean in fine print legislation, not in the propaganda they push on us.

On the other hand I do believe it socialism is enslaving and that fully socializing medicine is a big step toward interfering in the most private of decisions. The fact that we are already far down that road isn’t the point for those who are trying to preserve the Constitution, they are rather excited that finally an awakening has come and hope that this will go far beyond rejecting national healthcare but rolling back the entire state influence on this and other industries.

Another point to consider, and maybe you will agree, I was reading something about 18th and early 19th Century socialist experiments in America, the reviewer observed that what success they had (which wasn’t much) had much to do with the fact that it was surrounded by a prosperous capitalist system. I’ve argued this for some time about let’s say Switzerland that has quite a bit of capitalist money over the years stored in its banks — and how many socialist states have stayed afloat with American grants, investments, loans, and technology? But what happens when America finally goes the distance, what happens to those countries, and to what free and prosperous nation will we lean on? This is, I believe, a legitimate concern. Some used to say that when the lights go out in America the lights will go out on the world. I tend to believe that.

Ben, have a happy New Year and thank you for your thought provoking comments!

]]> By: Ben Hoffman http://www.themoralliberal.com/2009/12/25/what-dickens-scrooge-should-teach-us-farrell/comment-page-1/#comment-90 Ben Hoffman Sun, 27 Dec 2009 20:15:11 +0000 http://centerformoralliberalism.wordpress.com/?p=4015#comment-90 I don't think socialized health insurance is going to enslave anyone. But the real problem in our country is corporatism, which seems to be supported by both parties. I don’t think socialized health insurance is going to enslave anyone. But the real problem in our country is corporatism, which seems to be supported by both parties.

]]> By: Steve Farrell http://www.themoralliberal.com/2009/12/25/what-dickens-scrooge-should-teach-us-farrell/comment-page-1/#comment-89 Steve Farrell Sat, 26 Dec 2009 18:30:05 +0000 http://centerformoralliberalism.wordpress.com/?p=4015#comment-89 Well, perhaps Ben. But there is a very distinct line between the wealth redistribution of the Judeo-Christianity ethic and the socialist perspective, the former is a free will offering the latter compelled, the former strengthens the bonds of love between giver and receiver, the latter creates a Scrooge like resentment such as: "are there no work houses, no prisons ..." that they can go to, for my taxes pay for these things; while simultaneously begetting a sense of entitlement and covetousness, or the sin of "pride looking up" among receivers. The former leaves man free, the other in time enslaves him. My vote is for Santa over Marx. :) Well, perhaps Ben. But there is a very distinct line between the wealth redistribution of the Judeo-Christianity ethic and the socialist perspective, the former is a free will offering the latter compelled, the former strengthens the bonds of love between giver and receiver, the latter creates a Scrooge like resentment such as: “are there no work houses, no prisons …” that they can go to, for my taxes pay for these things; while simultaneously begetting a sense of entitlement and covetousness, or the sin of “pride looking up” among receivers. The former leaves man free, the other in time enslaves him. My vote is for Santa over Marx. :)

]]> By: Ben Hoffman http://www.themoralliberal.com/2009/12/25/what-dickens-scrooge-should-teach-us-farrell/comment-page-1/#comment-88 Ben Hoffman Fri, 25 Dec 2009 15:05:27 +0000 http://centerformoralliberalism.wordpress.com/?p=4015#comment-88 Santa Claus is a socialist. :) Santa Claus is a socialist. :)

]]>